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Favourite papers

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#1 afx

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Posted 21 August 2012 - 10:11

Time to start the first thread in this sub-forum....

So what are your favorite papers (including canvas) and why (what types of subjects, b&w or color)?
On what machine do you print them and where did you get the profile from (Manufacturer, custom service, self made)?

cheers
afx

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#2 afx

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Posted 21 August 2012 - 10:25

I print on an Epson R3000, currently my favorite papers are

Museo Textured Rag:
Mostly monochrome/BW, but color works surprisingly well depending on the subject, I have printed images for a friends exhibition of the Munich town-hall clockwork that look just great.
I do not have the dmax values for that paper, but visually, it easily holds up against the Barytas I tried (Canson, Hahnemühle), definitely better then the Hahnemühle mattes I tried.
I do mount them without glass as I hate the reflections.
Self made profile (ColorMunki with ArgyllCMS)

Canson Baryta Photographique:
All kinds of color stuff.
Canson supplied profile.

Museo Artist Cards:
A thin pre-creased matte paper that comes with envelopes in various sizes (I use the ones that end up square when folded).
Makes nice Xmas cards.
Museo supplied profile.

cheers
afx
"Patriotism is the virtue of the vicious" - Oscar Wilde
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
My latest book: The AfterShot Survival Guide  
sRGB clipping sucks and Adobe RGB is just as bad  Still no clue how to take decent pictures though, see afximages.com ;-(

#3 Rags

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Posted 21 August 2012 - 14:26

What are Canson & Museo profiles?

Thanks for the post

Rags

Edited by Rags, 21 August 2012 - 14:26 .


#4 afx

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Posted 21 August 2012 - 14:31

What are Canson & Museo profiles?

The manufacturers profiles as offered on their web site.

cheers
afx
"Patriotism is the virtue of the vicious" - Oscar Wilde
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
My latest book: The AfterShot Survival Guide  
sRGB clipping sucks and Adobe RGB is just as bad  Still no clue how to take decent pictures though, see afximages.com ;-(

#5 Alan7140

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 08:38

Canson Infinity Water Resistant Matte Artist's Canvas.
Innova Premium Smooth Cotton Matte.
Ilford Gallerie Gold Fibre Silk.
I don't do gloss.
All custom profiled for my Epson 7800 by Image Science, Melbourne.

#6 JohnBrew

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 15:31

Ilford Gold Fibre Silk for 8" x 10"
Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta and Photo Rag Pearl for everything else.

#7 yunfat

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 17:34

1) Office Depot double sided matte (It's actually Tecco premium matte imported from Germany). Goes on sale for $20 per 100 sheets. Unfortunately only available in US letter size.

2) Epson Cold and Hot Press are da shizzle, I have had good luck with all 4 varieties. The natural is so good for sepia, I can sing songs about this combo and Epson K3 magenta.

3) Used to love Crane Silver Rag, now Museo, if I had to print Glossy.

Edited by yunfat, 26 August 2012 - 17:34 .


#8 Carolyn

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 18:34

Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta. Considered gloss, but really more of a lustre. Uneven stippling for a darkroom print look. 100% cotton rag. No oba's = therefore no potential colour shift over time as the oba's fade. To me that is very important. To others, not so. The paper is developed specifically for black and white printing, high d-max, 315 gsm (good heavy paper). I used to use Crane's Silver Rag, but when the company was bought out, the quality dropped, and the stippling was always more *machined* looking... not random in appearance. I use Ilford Gold Fibre Silk for proofing, because it gives me a good enough idea if I'm on the right track, for a lower price. Unfortunately, the Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta is quite costly.
I choose not to use alpha cellulose papers. I prefer 100% cotton rag. I don't use the Hahnemuhle canned profile.
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#9 wildoat

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 19:16

This is a very useful thread, thanks for the valuable info guys.
 

 

 

It's about time we started to take photography seriously and treat it as a hobby.- Elliott Erwitt

 

 


 


#10 Ian

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 20:54

“favorite paper”.. That does open a can of worms and everyone has an opinion.
My opinion is that you go through life trying this and that and your tastes change as you do so. The same for papers and your favourite is just that, at some snapshot in time.

It depends on the image, the printer, the environment, the cost and the orientation of the stars. It also depends on the client.

Ilford GFS is an excellent baryta paper which is undergoing a re-naming by its retailers and I do not know what its new name will be. I used to use it a lot but it has a fiendish problem with curl close to the end of the roll.

I would go through a heavy decurling process to find that hours later its curl re-appeared. This is after I located special humidity control in my printing room. YMMV.

It also has a propensity to attract scratches just by looking at it!.

Maybe a slight exaggeration but I gave up using it some time ago and only run it if a client wants “exactly the same paper as last time”. It does have a very good colour range and Dmax and for its type it is reasonably cheap. People tended to migrate to IGFS from Somerset Velvet.

While IGFS is reasonably cheap, I am truly impressed that Carolyn can throw enough money at her photography to use it as a proof paper. Most printers I know use Epson Enhanced Matte because it is dirt cheap.

When I have to print on paper I now use Canson Platine Fibre Rag, a beautiful paper that grows on you in a Zen fashion. It does not have OBAs like IGFS so is likely to stand the sunlight better. The old sepia prints had a look which sucked you in deeper and deeper into the print. This paper is a bit like that.

When a client wants pizzazz I occasionally give them Inkpress Metallic.

However for my own use and for some clients, I will use canvas. Currently Breathing Color’s Lyve but I will probably go back to Lexjet’s Sunset Select Matte. Canvas only makes sense if you have a printer capable of taking roll product but it offers wonderful freedom from the hassles of handling paper cut sheet.

For a different market, I run Phototex, a really interesting product created for use in very large murals. If you have a decent RIP you can print multiple rolls and put it up like wallpaper.

This is done on my HP Z3100 which has a built-in spectrophotometer so I create exact profiles for my specific machine on each batch of paper/canvas I run through it.

However, all of this begs the next question. How do you protect it? Paper needs glass and a mat frame, canvas needs varnish.
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#11 Rags

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 21:13

This is a very useful thread, thanks for the valuable info guys.


Yup, I agree....

Rags

#12 Carolyn

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 22:29

“favorite paper”.. That does open a can of worms and everyone has an opinion.
My opinion is that you go through life trying this and that and your tastes change as you do so. The same for papers and your favourite is just that, at some snapshot in time.

It depends on the image, the printer, the environment, the cost and the orientation of the stars. It also depends on the client.
It also, or in my case, more importantly, depends on what *I* like. I use an Epson 7880 at the beach, and an Epson 7900 in the dry dry mountains of Utah.

Ilford GFS is an excellent baryta paper which is undergoing a re-naming by its retailers and I do not know what its new name will be. I used to use it a lot but it has a fiendish problem with curl close to the end of the roll.

I would go through a heavy decurling process to find that hours later its curl re-appeared. This is after I located special humidity control in my printing room. YMMV.

It also has a propensity to attract scratches just by looking at it!.
I use it for proofing, stack the papers, toss them about.... and don't have that problem?

Maybe a slight exaggeration but I gave up using it some time ago and only run it if a client wants “exactly the same paper as last time”. It does have a very good colour range and Dmax and for its type it is reasonably cheap. People tended to migrate to IGFS from Somerset Velvet.

While IGFS is reasonably cheap, I am truly impressed that Carolyn can throw enough money at her photography to use it as a proof paper. Most printers I know use Epson Enhanced Matte because it is dirt cheap.
I really don't throw money at my photography. I spend what I need to spend to get the results I want. For me. Period. I'm just fortunate enough that a large enough number of collectors and folks that want to look at my mountains (or whatever) pay the price, so I can do this. It's a heck of a lot less expensive than proofing on my final print paper. There I go.... throwing more money around :victory:

When I have to print on paper I now use Canson Platine Fibre Rag, a beautiful paper that grows on you in a Zen fashion. It does not have OBAs like IGFS so is likely to stand the sunlight better. The old sepia prints had a look which sucked you in deeper and deeper into the print. This paper is a bit like that.
oba's will fade over time regardless of sunlight.... and sunlight will kill most any photograph over time. According to Wilhelm... no direct sunlight, no indirect sunlight, and even the lighting source can be detrimental.

When a client wants pizzazz I occasionally give them Inkpress Metallic.

However for my own use and for some clients, I will use canvas. Currently Breathing Color’s Lyve but I will probably go back to Lexjet’s Sunset Select Matte. Canvas only makes sense if you have a printer capable of taking roll product but it offers wonderful freedom from the hassles of handling paper cut sheet.

For a different market, I run Phototex, a really interesting product created for use in very large murals. If you have a decent RIP you can print multiple rolls and put it up like wallpaper.

This is done on my HP Z3100 which has a built-in spectrophotometer so I create exact profiles for my specific machine on each batch of paper/canvas I run through it.

However, all of this begs the next question. How do you protect it? Paper needs glass and a mat frame, canvas needs varnish.


For permanence, paper needs museum mounting and handling. For true permanence information, turn to Wilhelm Imaging. Some very important photographs are stored underground in cold storage. Brought out and framed for exhibits, put back when done. I have one collector that does that at his home. He rotates his art that is on display (oils/sculptures/photographs...) with the help of Christie's and Sotheby's curators... who are (many of them) trained by Wilhelm's associates.

I think it's very important to realize that many of us come at this from different perspectives.... :good: And what is throwing money around to some, may be investing in themselves to others.
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#13 kelang

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 22:31

Epson Exibition Fiber Pro on Epson Stylus Pro 3800. Gotten some nice results with other stuff and really itching to us the Moab metallic I just got.

#14 Carolyn

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 22:37

Epson Exibition Fiber Pro on Epson Stylus Pro 3800. Gotten some nice results with other stuff and really itching to us the Moab metallic I just got.


I like the exhibition fiber pro, but can't use it due to the oba's as mentioned above. And again, to clarify.... most folks don't worry 'bout that.... and I can't say you should. Personal choice there.
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#15 James Fitzgerald

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Posted 27 August 2012 - 03:06

I blame Carolyn for my paper of choice... Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta. It's a joy to see a well made print on this paper.
The paper is on the expensive side, but if you want to best present your best work, well...

I didn't seriously try to make digital prints until the last year or so, prior to that it was darkroom or commercial labs. Boy, did I have a lot to learn.

Ilford Gold Fibre Silk is a fine paper. I don't find it excessively expensive for proofing. I usually will start with 6X9 on 8.5X11 paper, about a buck a sheet.
The colour/tone and Dmax are very good for B&W printing. The main reason I won't print larger on this paper is that I don't care for the texture. Too smooth.
I've printed on Museo Silver Rag which is good, but got frustrated with the poor quality control. Just found too many defects.

My experience is with B&W prints. I'm sure there are other great choices for colour.
I have several colour images I think would benefit from a metallic paper. I'd love to hear from any members with experience with these.

#16 Alan7140

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Posted 27 August 2012 - 03:24

I like the exhibition fiber pro, but can't use it due to the oba's as mentioned above. And again, to clarify.... most folks don't worry 'bout that.... and I can't say you should. Personal choice there.


Not so sure that such generous latitude should be given, Carolyn.

Paper should be cotton, not lignin based. OBA's should be absent. Common sense, scientific sense, personal choice irrelevant. :D

I only use the Ilford Gallerie for convenience when specifically asked for a semi glossy print. So ordinarily I'll print either Canson canvas or Innova smooth cotton, both are cotton based and OBA free.

Although this might change if, as I fear, the X-Pro1 has me back to B&W again. Canvas B&W sucks big time, and the Innova is a bit too flat in the shadows. I might try the Hahnemühle for this use. Damn, another custom profile.....

Handy to see what others are using, good thread.

#17 Carolyn

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Posted 27 August 2012 - 03:55

Not so sure that such generous latitude should be given, Carolyn.

Paper should be cotton, not lignin based. OBA's should be absent. Common sense, scientific sense, personal choice irrelevant. :D
Fred, I agree, and that's one reason I don't like the Canson Baryta Photographic. It is an alpha cellulose paper (think trees)... try to give latitude amap, because I have been accused of being opinionated on more that one occasion. Guess I am. But it really is after much research... ;)

I only use the Ilford Gallerie for convenience when specifically asked for a semi glossy print. So ordinarily I'll print either Canson canvas or Innova smooth cotton, both are cotton based and OBA free.

Although this might change if, as I fear, the X-Pro1 has me back to B&W again. Canvas B&W sucks big time, and the Innova is a bit too flat in the shadows. I might try the Hahnemühle for this use. Damn, another custom profile.....
Berkley at Pictureline in SLC, UT, makes custom profiles. You mail him your printout, he emails the custom profile back to you. Last I checked, he was charging $25.00.... and that is stupidly cheap.....
Handy to see what others are using, good thread.


:) This is fun..... I do so LOVE to print.....
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#18 Rags

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Posted 27 August 2012 - 17:46

I blame Carolyn for my paper of choice... Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta. It's a joy to see a well made print on this paper.
The paper is on the expensive side, but if you want to best present your best work, well...

I didn't seriously try to make digital prints until the last year or so, prior to that it was darkroom or commercial labs. Boy, did I have a lot to learn.

Ilford Gold Fibre Silk is a fine paper. I don't find it excessively expensive for proofing. I usually will start with 6X9 on 8.5X11 paper, about a buck a sheet.
The colour/tone and Dmax are very good for B&W printing. The main reason I won't print larger on this paper is that I don't care for the texture. Too smooth.
I've printed on Museo Silver Rag which is good, but got frustrated with the poor quality control. Just found too many defects.

My experience is with B&W prints. I'm sure there are other great choices for colour.
I have several colour images I think would benefit from a metallic paper. I'd love to hear from any members with experience with these.


I had rust images printed on metallic and it poped. Over sharpened and saturated the tryptec is impressive

Some red rock from Southern Utah is also impressive - all gloss

Posted Image

Don't know its effect on B&W, except I'll guess the geometric high contrast glossy architectural prints way work

Rags

Edited by Rags, 27 August 2012 - 17:48 .


#19 Chris Wahl

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Posted 27 August 2012 - 18:51

Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta
Canson Baryta Photographique
Canson BFK Rives

depending on subject matter and availability :)

Epson papers for proofs.

I am not into pro printing but I love good paper ... just like with books ... I hardly adapt to eBooks at home (on the road it's a different thing ...)

Chris
Never mind the words ... just hum along and keep on going...

#20 Rags

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 16:22

What papers have the best abrasion resistance if hung without glass?

Rags




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